The Distillation of Jonny Kim

The Distillation of NASA astronaut Jonny Kim

A Navy SEAL, a Harvard Medical Doctor & a NASA Astronaut walk into a bar… and they’re all one person. Meet Jonny Kim, hands down one of the most impressive people you will ever come across. A case could be made that no one alive has earned positions in 3 organizations with a more difficult selection process than what Jonny has done. If anyone accomplished one of these things in their lifetime it would be an impressive feat that few have ever done. How this man has accomplished all three still blows my mind. It becomes even more miraculous what Jonny has been able to do when you learn about how he grew up and what he had to overcome just to stay alive. Let’s distill Jonny Kim and find out how all this is possible…

“You can be born with bad cards…but you have a choice and the power to craft your own destiny”

When talking about his childhood Jonny says “It just seems like a different life to me now because I’ve had different experiences and so many humbling experiences and I think about where I came from it seems like a big accident… This seems like an accident to be sitting here with you talking about this. Everything I’ve done is an accident, being a seal was an accident, going to medical school, being a physician, being an astronaut, those were all accidents. Not part of the plan at all. All I wanted to do as a well grown up was protect my family and protect my mother and my brother from my father who was very abusive.”

Growing Up

Jonny was born in Los Angeles in 1984 to 1st generation Korean American parents. His father was an alcoholic and Jonny grew up being “I was a scared little boy. Scared of the world, scared of relationships, scared of talking to people, going to school, of having my own opinions, speaking up or fighting for what I believe is right. I was so scared, deathly scared of my father.”

What astonishes me is how adaptable humans are. To think he grew up in these circumstances with that type of mindset and he’s gone on to make it through three of the most intense selection processes in the world in becoming a Navy SEAL, Harvard Medical School MD and a Nasa Astronaut. I hear Jonny’s story and it makes me believe that no matter who, where or what you are in life you can turn your situation around and do something spectacular.
“All those experiences, while they were terrible at that time, I wouldn’t trade any of that for anything. I would never want to trade that because everything that happened helped me to be the person I am today.”

February 21, 2002

“I was home with my mother and it was during the day and my father came home and he was supposed to be at work so I think it was a little surprising. I remember when he came home I could smell the whiskey on his breath so I knew he was very intoxicated. I could feel something was different this time, there was a tension and I knew I had to stick around. My mother was surprised and scared to see him there and they were in the kitchen and I stuck close by on the couch in the living room. I remember my father came out to me and the last words he said to me was ‘I’m sorry Jonathan’ and he pepper sprayed my face. And then all I hear in the kitchen is my mother screaming for help and saying ‘He’s got a gun!’ So then you know fight or flight, you do what you need to do to protect the people you love. So I got up and I did my best to fight him and get that gun. And fought as hard as I could. As strong as a 140 pound kid could do at the time. But I lost that fight and still have a scar right around here from where my father was able to get a hold of a dumbbell nearby and smash my head in with it. I think he kind of turned the fight and he was able to get his gun out of his pocket. And shot it in the air.
It was the 1st time in my life that I faced a life or death situation as you know there were many more to come later but for different reasons. But this was my 1st taste of it and I don’t know how maybe by the grace of God or something that I said you know I remember clearly pleading with him that we loved him and that he didn’t have to do this. I clearly remember saying, ‘It’s not too late! You have the power to decide right now it’s not too late!’ And I think maybe clarity or grace in a moment of clarity that my father found, he decided not to shoot us not to kill us and I told him to go run just run. And he did.
He left the back door and that was the last time I saw my father. In the hysteria of that my mother was on the phone and called 911 and screaming for help and so eventually the ambulances came in and police came. I got my head stapled at the hospital and came back to my house so the police were there to write a report. I came back into my room and I noticed that things had shifted. I have a closet that has access to the attic and I noticed that furniture was moved in such a way to gain access to the attic. And I told the police that I think my father is still in the house and he’s in the attic. So they did what they’re trained to do. They sectioned off the area and they confronted my father and one thing led to another. I was there. But shots were fired and my father was killed. And I remember that day so vividly it was. I don’t mean to sound callous but in a lot of ways it liberated me.
It liberated my mother. It was one of the hardest and most sad days for her but it liberated her and liberated myself and my brother. It taught me and set the benchmark for me to do so many more things in my life. Because I don’t think I was meant to be a SEAL, I don’t think I was born to do any of the things that I’ve had the opportunity to do but because of those experiences, being able to stand up to a person, to a figure who I feared more than anyone. To be able to do something that I never thought I could possibly do, standing up to someone, especially someone who was threatening to kill you and the person you loved most, it was empowering. It liberated me and taught me I’m not the scared little boy I thought I was. I can do these things that I know I can be a part of something bigger than myself.”
“I want to be clear, I have no ill feelings towards my father and I have forgiven him over the years of abuse that he gave. When I grew a little bit older and I understood where he came from he also came from a pretty terrible home situation and I think his demons, he just didn’t have the tools or the aptitude or the mental strength to deal with those demons.”
“It’s weird for me to be recounting the story publicly. If it were up to me I’d keep it close to the chest for all my days but as I’ve grown older I’ve come to realize that there is value for other people. I’m not the only person in this situation, frankly there are people in way worse situations than I am than I was in who are still in it for them to know that. You can be born with bad cards. You don’t need to have it all but you have a choice and the power to craft your own destiny, your own path and for that reason I think it’s less important that I keep stuff like this close to my chest and that’s why I’m sharing it with you.”

Hearing About the Navy SEAL teams at Age 16

Jonny’s friend told him about Navy SEALs in 1999 and how they were “They were these quiet professional warriors that do these hard things that no one else wants to do and never seek recognition for those actions and there was something about that creed that drew me in a way I’ve never felt before. It called for me. So I went home and went to my 56 k. modem and read everything I could about what it was and still is. I read a book that was pretty formative for me, it was, Men in Green Faces by Gene Wentz and my decision was made, ‘this is what I’m going to do’. A week after discovering what it was I told my mom I’m going to be a Navy SEAL and she had no idea what it was you had to explain to her.”
Jonny found Stu Smith’s book The Complete Guide to Navy Seal Fitness (complete disclosure I wanted to be a Navy SEAL growing up and I had this book and loved working at becoming a SEAL) and started training after school following their fitness routines.
“I knew college was not for me. I was lost. I didn’t know what I wanted to do after high school but I knew it wasn’t college and so when I heard about the SEAL teams it was this calling, this is what I’m going to do and it was to date it is the strongest calling I’ve had.”

When people ask me why I want to be a SEAL it’s so easy to come up with superficial reasons but I wanted to get paid to blow up stuff and jump out of a plane and serve my country and shoot guns but those are all fake superficial reasons. I didn’t do it for those, those are absolute pluses but that is not why. I wanted to be on a team. I wanted to transform my life. I wanted to learn the skills to develop, the strength to become a different person, to find my identity, be someone that could protect the people that I loved that couldn’t protect themselves. And now that I have more awareness of human psychology and the experiences in an armed environment and how it shapes us into the people we become and in the decisions we make. I realize that it was completely born out of my situation with my father and wanting to protect my brother and my mother and that extending to really all people. I thought this is just to show how little we know when we are young. I thought that being a seal would solve all my life’s problems and it gave clarity and focus to so many but it probably created just as many more. But it gave me tools to deal with those problems.

Jonny’s Desire to Help

“One of the reasons why I wanted to be a doctor was not because I was in love with medicine, I mean I do like medicine but it’s to serve a cause greater than myself that leaves a positive mark in this world. It’s the same reason why I wanted to be an astronaut…I think my mother had a large part in it. She’s one of the strongest women I know and seeing that strength in that selflessness in that sacrifice. She sacrificed her dreams, she could have been someone, she’s a smart woman. And she’s a beautiful woman. She didn’t have to be with my father but I after having 2 boys and loving her children so much that she would sacrifice her dreams and her potential to protect us. I think that had a significant effect on me so if there’s anyone to credit it would be my mother.”

You Couldn’t Convince Me to do Anything Else but Enlist in the Military

“I want to be in the trenches. I want to be the one working my way up learning from everyone else, learning the ropes and roughing it, being in the trenches with boys, that’s all I wanted to do.”
“It was the best decision I have ever made and every time I say that I think of my wife because I think marrying my wife was the best decision I made but it’s a little different. You understand what I mean by it was the best decision for me in my growth and development to join the military and it’s not like that for I’m not trying to sound like a recruiter join the military it’s not for everyone but it was for me. I would tell you that this is true for my wife for sure if I didn’t join the Navy, if I didn’t go in the SEAL team’s my wife probably wouldn’t have married me because I wouldn’t have been the human that I am and to this day if like the reason that where happily married is rooted in the fact.”

Naval Special Warfare Preparatory school A.K.A. BUD/s

Because of his training and emphasis on calisthenics and bodyweight exercises Jonny felt he was well prepared for BUD/s. He would have eaten a lot more calories during BUD/s and before just to be bigger for things such as the log carry.

Dive Phase of BUD/s

The diving phase of BUD/S training develops and qualifies SEAL candidates as competent basic combat swimmers. During this period, physical training continues and becomes even more intensive. This second phase concentrates on dive physics, underwater skills, and combat SCUBA. Candidates will learn two types of SCUBA: open circuit (compressed air) and closed circuit. Also, basic dive medicine and medical skills training is provided. Emphasis is placed on long-distance underwater dives with the goal of training students to become basic combat divers, using swimming and diving techniques as a means of transportation from their launch point to their combat objective. This is what separates SEALs from all other US Special Operations Forces. By the end of Second Phase, candidates must complete a timed 2-mile swim with fins in 80 minutes, the 4-mile run with boots in 31 minutes, a 3.5-mile and 5.5-mile swim. Successful Second Phase Candidates demonstrate a high level of comfort in the water and the ability to perform in stressful and often uncomfortable environments. Candidates who are not completely comfortable in the water often struggle to succeed.
Dive Phase is where you see a lot of people fail because they’re uncomfortable with the water but Jonny was comfortable from his water polo background. “You are your own greatest enemy in the water. If you just maintain clarity and focus and calm your nerves everything will be Ok. It’s when you thrash and panic you get air hungry.”

Did anything in BUD/s give you problems?

“I want to be clear I was not a stellar performer. I was a middle of the pack runner and swimmer and everything along with the boats. You know there’s a standard, it’s not just don’t quit, you need to perform to a standard and for me I just wanted to make it clear I was giving my heart in everything I did so that I cared more about what my boat crew thought then me.”
“You know there were certainly hard times. I don’t think there was ever a time where I went like “I’m going to quit”, but there were definitely times where I wanted the pain to stop. In one particular time I remember it was, you know, a 2 hour nap you get in BUDs during Hell Week where we go in a warm sleeping bag on a cot and they wake you up and they just whisper in your ear. In the nicest most compassionate voice and it disarms you right because they have circumvented that fight or flight response. You don’t mount a defense, you just immediately get woken up very nicely and get sent to the cold water. That was close to where I was like I want this to stop. I want this pain and suffering to stop but as far as being like I want to quit or I’m going to quit. No”

“I didn’t think about quitting at all. I was like “whatever, bring it”. I think there’s a difference between wanting to think about quitting and thinking about just wanting it to stop. I was definitely like ‘it sucks’. But you know what, I felt free when I showed up to BUD/s and I got wet and sandy. My buddy Jordan Lewis and I got a picture of when we 1st got wet and sandy in white shirts and we’re just beaming with smiles just like I was so happy to be there, he was so happy to be starting my journey of embracing that suffering and suck.”

Jonny’s & Jocko Willink’s Thoughts on War

Jonny “I wanted war. I think it’s hard to articulate why, but a lot of people feel this way who train to do something they want. I don’t know how you feel about the experiences we’ve gone through and I wouldn’t trade it for anything. War is pretty ugly.”
Jocko “Yeah for sure you know I was on a guy named Sam Harris’s podcast and he called me out because I talk about how leading men in combat is the best thing in my life and and then I also say war is absolute you know the most horrible thing in the world. He goes, ‘How do you reconcile those 2 things?’ The way I explained it to him I said ‘If you ever met someone who has cancer that survives and when they get through they say they say you know I’m glad it happened to me because they learn so much. They would never wish it on anybody oh well that’s pretty much exactly how I feel about war.” Jonny- “I’ve never heard that analogy but I think it’s on point I would never trade it for anything and I would go back in the trenches right now in a split 2nd with my brothers.”

Have a Singular Goal

“What I’m trying to point out is that there wasn’t a plan. I mean the plan for me was just like I told you all I wanted to be was a SEAL. I had no idea, no aspirations to be in a position to be an astronaut. I just had one goal at a time. That’s really important to me even to this day that you have one singular goal because you should be all in what you’re doing. You should be genuine in what you’re doing, not have some social climbing, some professional ladder that you’re trying to meet these goals in the stepping stones.”

Anything That’s Challenging Fascinates Me

“I’m fascinated by anything that’s challenging. If it’s engineering, space, medicine, anything that challenges you is fascinating.”
Jonny became a medic because he thought it was the fastest route to combat. “I thought it was complete chaos and loved it. I came to learn medicine is pretty cool and I took it seriously, though I didn’t want to be a medic. I understand the gravity of that kind of honor, that you were entrusted with the lives of your teammates. That’s a huge honor and I took it seriously. So once the decision was made that I’m going to do that I was all in. I’m going to be the best that I can be. Being in 18 Delta honestly, those 6 months were more difficult than any time I had any school because it’s so much material crammed into 6 months on how to be a trauma combat medic and you learn a lot of skills and you learn how to do chest tubes which is a procedure that physicians train years through medical school and residency to learn how to do and you learn how to do that in 6 months.”

SEAL Team 3 & Sniper School

Sniper School is one of the most sought after schools as a SEAL and it’s incredibly rare that one guy gets to go to both Sniper School and Medic School.
“You know I had an awareness of where I stood on the totem pole and it was as a new guy. I knew I was smaller in stature and I just wanted to prove myself. I was so hungry to do a good job. I knew sniper school can be hard but I’m going to do everything to not fail this and bring this asset to the platoon.”
Jonny had no shooting experience prior to entering Sniper School which is extremely rare and he had to work through that by firing thousands of rounds. Reps work. “I almost did not make it through because you had to get a certain score on the rifle. But something clicked. If you just stick to the points of performance front sight focus, body positioning, follow through breathing. They work.” It always comes down to mastering the basics and going back to the fundamentals.

1st Deployment as a Navy SEAL

“I loved it and that’s when I was finally in a situation that I wanted to do. I felt a calling too. When I was growing up in my adolescent years there was never anything I felt I was born to do and for the 1st time I felt accepted. I never felt accepted growing up… I never felt like I was accepted to a group until I was in the teams and I was home for the 1st time I was home.”
“What I appreciate about the teams was that it was a true meritocracy and you got out of it what you put in.” Sounds like Jonny would do great at Bridgewater working with Ray Dalio

Mutual Suffering & Hardships Bring People Together

“I am a firm believer that shared hardship and suffering is one of the best ways to bring people together towards a common goal, to break down barriers, to form a brotherhood, a sisterhood whatever you want to call it. Yeah, that’s what the team’s do.”

“That responsibility meant so much to me. I wanted to practice and train and wake up early and make sure I didn’t want to mess it up, not for myself but because I felt I owed that responsibility of doing a good job to my platoon… It was a never ending pursuit to be better and to accept responsibility for your failures and promise you will do better.”

Learning from Mentors

“I feel like I have been fortunate to have a lot of teachers, mentors, and role models along the way throughout life… Just trying to take a little bit of what they teach you. Those pearls of wisdom and incorporate into your own style what works for you.” It’s important to note that Jonny understands you need to take the wisdom from others but incorporate it into your own style. Josh Waitzkin touches on this

The Mental Preparation Jonny Did Prepare for Combat

“You know and I don’t think I’ve ever been asked about that. It’s a pretty insightful question and I don’t think I’ve asked other people what mental calculus they needed to go through to prepare themselves for these challenges. I know what I did and what worked for me and I don’t know if it works for other people or if that’s what other people did but I don’t have any qualms saying when I showed up to Iraq I was scared…. I quickly learned that the mental preparation I needed to do for myself was to assume I was going to die, that I was already dead. And I was there to fulfill my role in the position as a shooter and that was liberating for me.
It was hard to get in that frame of mind but once you got in that frame of mind for me it was easier to stay in that frame of mind. Kind of like how when I was cold and bloody I wanted to stay cold. There were guys who would take a warm shower if you had the opportunity to, but for me I wanted to stay uncomfortable because being comfortable being uncomfortable is an important trait and once I was able to reconcile that I wasn’t going to come home that I was going to die it freed me to be able to do my job without the human emotion that can be very disabling of which is fear. And I think it made me more clear of mind and focused and I think it made me a better operator but I don’t know if that works for everyone and I don’t think that is a very healthy state of mind to stay in for long periods of time.
I think you need to learn how to decompress and learn how to switch things on and off and have space in your brain compartmentalize. Spaces where you can put very bad emotions or very disabling emotions away so that you can do your job at hand. That’s what seemed to work for me.”

Napoleon’s ability to compartmentalize

This reminds me so much of Napoleon’s ability to compartmentalize. Napoleon’s capacity to compartmentalize his brain and focus entirely on each subject at a time of his own choosing, allowed him to control his empire to an astonishing degree and in a far more detailed way than any ruler had done before. “For Napoleon’s career demonstrated the importance of compartmentalization, meticulous planning, knowledge of terrain, superb timing, valuing the importance of discipline and training, understanding the psychology of the ordinary solider to create espirit de corps, the issuing of inspirational speeches and proclamations, controlling the news, adapting the tactical ideas of others, asking pertinent questions fo the right people, a deep learning and appreciation of history, a formidable memory, utter ruthlessness when necessary, the deployment of personal charisma, immense calm under unimaginable pressure (especially in moments that look like defeat), an almost obsessive compulsive attention to detail, rigorous control of emotions, and the ability to exploit a momentary numerical advantage at the decisive point on the battlefield – and, not least, good luck. Even though he was ultimately defeated, Napoleon is the wartime leader against whom all others must be judged.”- Andrew Roberts

The Greatest Fear of All

“The only thing stronger than fear for oneself for us was fear of letting your platoon down or fear of getting your friends killed. That to me is the greatest fear of all.”

August 2, 2006

“It’s hard to articulate in words what that day did. I talked a little bit in the beginning about how my father has shaped my actions to become a SEAL. Well, I’d say the events that unfolded on August 2nd 2006 and days afterwards where we lost much better warriors than I, much braver and selfless, that those were much more formative in shaping what I do and will do for the rest of my life. And we lost the actions of that day. We lost 2 really good men. I don’t even know where to start, you know. One of my good friends, one of our good friends Ryan Job was hit in the face and I learned a lot that day and we all did. And a piece of us stayed there that day.”
Marc Alan Lee was a United States Navy SEAL. He was the first SEAL to lose his life in Operation Iraqi Freedom when he was killed in a fierce firefight while on patrol against insurgents in Ramadi. Lee was posthumously awarded the Silver Star, the Bronze Star Medal with Valor and the Purple Heart
Ryan Job was shot in the face by a sniper. While his SEALs worked to save his life, Ryan regained consciousness, told them that he was OK, then as if raising from the dead he stood up and evacuated himself while his team covered him as they shot their way to an awaiting Bradley. Ryan said that if it were not for his training and his fellow SEALs who cared for him, he would have died that day. The wound rendered Ryan totally blind, forcing him to medically retire from the Navy.

Taking on Risks for the General Good of Humanity

“We see things happen all the time that we know aren’t right. Sometimes you just know deep down that it’s not right and you choose your battles. I think it’s important to choose what battles you stand up more for. There are some battles that you should never ever stand down from and I swore I would never make that mistake again. And then I find it very relevant today. I mean we accept the risks of our occupation for the greater good of what it does for society, our country, our species and it’s relevant in space exploration in NASA and what I have been honored and privileged to take part of. And we accept the risks of what we are trying to do for the general good and what it brings back to humanity but I think having that experience to know it’s worth cashing in that currency that reputation you’ve built up to speak up when something is up when something’s messed up.”
“The void created by those warriors that would certainly have done good for this world that I owe it that we owe it to them to be a positive mark in this world. And that can take many forms for me that was why I wanted to be a physician. It didn’t really matter that it was medicine and it was just natural for me because that’s what I was involved in to take that level of service to a higher calling. Like trying to become an astronaut is completely consistent with my promise to leave a positive impact in this world and that’s how I honor the brothers we lost and I will never stop until the day I die trying to fill in that void because it’s a void that can never be filled in.”

Navy SEAL

Jonny served as a Special Operations Combat Medic, sniper, navigator and point man spanning two deployments and completing over 100 combat operations spanning two deployments to the Middle East, including Ramadi and Sadr City, Iraq.
After completing his training at Naval Special Warfare, Jonny reported to John F. Kennedy Special Warfare Center and School in Fort Bragg, NC, for the Special Operations Combat Medic Course. He was assigned as a Special Warfare Operator to SEAL Team THREE Charlie Platoon in San Diego.
Kim is also the recipient of a Silver and Bronze Star with valor.

“We are a lot stronger and more capable than we know.”

Being in Control of Your Emotions is the Most Important Thing For a Leader

“Human psychology is everything. Learning how to be in control of your emotions and body language. How you craft your words is probably the most important thing you can do as a leader. It took me many years to learn this..I did not learn as a 22 year old kid coming back from deployment I did not learn how to detach myself how to be emotionless because while human emotion is what makes us human and has some of the best aspects of what makes us human it is all also the biggest hindrance to getting stuff done to completing the mission. Ego is a part of narcissism. Those are human emotions but they’re walls and when you bring emotion to the table you are mounting defenses that make it hard to get to the core of your argument of what your vision is and I’ve come up with countless stories where I failed in that endeavor. I have learned through experience and through just watching other people observing making mistakes being in the Seal teams of learning to fine tune that mode, the emotional and social intelligence to know the human psychology of the person you’re talking to. How to disarm their defenses if they are in motion if they are emotional or disagree with you. I firmly believe that all people want good things. We just disagree on how to get from point a to point b. That’s where we mount our defenses and lose sight of the big picture but if you can take a step back remove your ego and emotion from the picture and find common ground that’s where you can influence and share your vision to complete your objective and that’s applicable in everything we do. That’s applicable in politics, in business in medicine in what I do as a national and NASA is trying to share that vision trying to get that buy in and it all starts with. Understanding the human condition.”
“I could have been more effective just slowing down and using the intrinsic emotion I was having as a tell, because if you can be a little more in control and understanding of your own emotions it can tell you, it can give you hints as to what is going on and how to properly respond and craft your words to get your message across.”

2nd Deployment as a Navy SEAL

“For seals like me because I only did 2 tours, 2 deployments which for people who don’t know in the grand scheme of things that’s nothing compared to the experience of a lot of SEALs and a lot of soldiers, Marines who have done multiple tours.The 1st one we had a lot of heavy sustained combat experience and being able to take those experiences forward this time. Not as a new guy but having new SEALs and opportunity and being willing to mentor them was a privilege and honor. I remember feeling drastically different the 2nd time through and still of course learning every single day but also knowing that you serve as a role model in everything you do.” – Jonny touches on the value of experience not only for yourself but also the impact experience has on inexperienced people you work with. There is something to be said for earned wisdom. I also appreciate how Jonny went on second deployment with the beginner’s mind, willing to learn every single day. His humility allows him to be open to new experiences and lessons.
“Losing a lot of good friends galvanized me and made a lot of my remaining teammates make sure we made our lives worthwhile. I still, to this day, every day, think of all the good people who didn’t get a chance to come home. I try to make up for the lives and positive [impact] they would have had if they were alive.”

Lessons Learned From Other Leaders

“I admired Mike long ago from BUDs. Being an 18 year old kid and obviously you know Mike he was a former Roper, a Marine Force Recon Staff Sergeant. So you know when we were in BUDs we were enamored with his experience but also his ability to talk respectfully and speak the language to the other officers and the instructors but also speak to the level of the lowest enlisted and that’s a skill that’s hard to learn. I was unaware at the time but also making observations and taking unconscious notes to incorporate in my own quest to learn how to share my vision and how to be a follower and how to be a leader later on in my life.”
Learning through osmosis and then incorporating your own style into your craft is something seen again and again in The Distillery.
“Life gives us tools to address the roadblocks and falls. Challenges make us uncomfortable and feel alone. But we are not alone; we are stronger together. Form bonds, trust, and depend on those around you.”

“I don’t know of too many things in this life that are good things that are without risk. That goes to every facet of life of business or combat of space exploration. All good things have a lot of risk and a lot of hard work to get there and certainly combat operations were no different.”

Reacclimating Back into Society

“We can talk a long time about reacclimating back to society and how to do that effectively and I think personally that that transition is so difficult that it is also the reason why a lot of people have trouble reacclimating back to society because you put that switch on for so long you just don’t know exactly how to turn it back off. I remember very clearly when I came back it was very raw, everything was raw and I was a lot more direct and I think the hate and anger in my heart had just swelled up. It took me years to readjust and reacclimate to get a better understanding of what I had been through and what I was feeling to be a productive member of society…you’re going to be in for a very big surprise, for a shock when you go back to the real world. You realize that people don’t respond in that fashion when you talk to them because that’s just not how most of society, most humans interact. They don’t interact on that type of level of intensity and rawness that was a huge, huge learning for me. I’m very thankful that I had the years of going to college or working in a different line of work to really understand that different human side, what a different part of what it meant to be human.”

Transitioning to College After Deployments

Jonny knew he eventually wanted to go to medical school so getting exceptional grades was going to be essential. In addition to being a full time student trying to cram a 4 year degree into 3 he was enrolled in ROTC and worked for the University of San Diego giving out parking tickets. Imagine being a Navy SEAL with two tours of duty and having to come back to an ROTC program with 18 year old kids and having to give out parking tickets to pay for school. “So it is an exercise in humility in giving parking tickets”
“So I give out parking tickets and some may see that oh well you went from doing these combat operations given orders to giving out parking tickets. Well for me it was an exercise in humility and you should never think you’re too good to do a job. I think you should be like that in everything you do, be a forever new guy is what I try to emulate and I don’t mean as in you shouldn’t step up to the role and be a leader and delegate appropriately but never think that you are above taking out the trash or that you’re above not respecting the secretary.”
“To this day never think you’re too good to do those jobs because the moment you start to think you’re better than anyone else you have poisoned yourself, you are on the dark path.”
“One of the biggest and hardest things for me to say is. I still to this day have a hard time saying it just because I think it’s just a word that’s very foreign to someone who was a SEAL. Learning to lower my defenses and be vulnerable was one of the biggest lights for me. Learning to be more human and that happened in medical school…. But having a conversation and that guidance to open up really helped me become a better human in many ways which then led to being a better follower. Being a better leader. so I mean those are one of many experiences in that phase of life that helped me be a better candidate for NASA and for other opportunities that have come.”

“That transition. The early years of medical school were the hardest sometimes. It’s weird to say but some of the hardest years of my life because it was different... It was the hardest years of my life because it’s not like you could just push through as we can in some of the things you do in BUDs or in teams. BUDs is a challenge but as you and I know training is nothing compared to war and you think training is hard, it’s hard right until you get punched in the face in a real combat operation and then you realize ‘oh I’ve reset my benchmark for what is hard or what is painful, what is suffering.’ Not having that benchmark going into transitioning to civilian life was hard for me. I was trying to fit in a 4 year degree in 3 years trying to do really well because I knew I had to get good grades to be considered for school at Harvard. I had my 1st child. I was working part time but probably the worst of it was I was not right in the head. With my decompression with post war I took a lot of that anger and hatred in my heart and I still had it there and I lost a little bit of who I was. It took years for me to regain that and it was only through the grace of time.”

The Why Behind Going to Harvard Medical School

“I wanted to be impactful and to me going to Harvard was giving me a better and bigger platform to be impactful. It wasn’t the name, it was even the brand, it was the education. You’d be fooling yourself to think that going to Harvard is going to make you a better doctor that’s not true at all you would be just as good of a doctor anywhere you go to in this country but it was having a platform to be able to effect positive change and that’s why I wanted to go to an institution like Johns Hopkins or Harvard.”

Emotional Intelligence

“It is probably one of the most important traits of being a leader is having emotional and social intelligence. Of knowing your audience and knowing who you’re talking to and being dynamic enough that you can switch and craft your language to your party. Your tone of voice is everything you do to suit the person you’re talking to.”

“That’s why blanket leadership tenants don’t work. Guiding principles work but you need to form it to your own style to achieve the result you want. And I think a lot of it starts with awareness, with mindfulness of your own emotions. Of the emotions, the body language that others are telling you because it gives you hints as to what they’re feeling. If you know what they’re feeling you understand where they’re coming from, with that perspective you can disarm people by finding common ground and achieving results because most of the time all people want good things, they just disagree on how to achieve that.”

Learning From Experience

“I wish I had a book like that to teach me but maybe I wouldn’t have been affected. I mean maybe it requires a little bit of suffering through those mistakes to really hit home. There are certain things you can learn from a book and certain things you can’t…I wish I didn’t have to learn these lessons the hard way but sometimes…. There is a right time and a right place to hear the lessons and advice and sometimes I’m certain a lot of lessons I follow in guiding principles I live by every day serving with humility remembering the sacrifices of others. Respecting everyone, not taking things for granted. Those lessons were sent to me as a kid. I just wasn’t in the right frame of mind to receive those lessons. So I firmly believe that people need to be ready to be mentors and to be taught. That’s what humility is all about. One of the things that I talk about is the one person that you can’t turn into to be a good leader is the one that’s not humble because they’re not listening to what you say and they’re not accepting any guidance and so you’re not going to be able to get them to move in the right direction they’re just going to continue to suck as a leader.” – When the student is ready, the teacher will appear.

How Hard Was Harvard Medical School?

“It was hard…. For me juggling the demands of a growing family, I had my 1st child and my 2nd child was born during school and my 3rd child was born during my internship. So I didn’t get much sleep and then you just learn to optimize your day. You can’t make more hours in the day and this is when I learned that becoming a morning person was a better way to optimize my day. I am not a genius by any means, I consider myself very average physically, mentally it’s just that I feel that I can stick with the goals and have deferred gratification to help support me for my goals that’s it work working hard is all I know I can do to make up for any advantages natural or otherwise that I don’t have. So I do feel that I had to study more than the average student at Harvard Medical School and there were some smart folks there.”

Learning To Optimize Your Day & Maintaining Your Health

“In medical school I was waking up around 3:30…. In your twenties you can eat junk food and you can get away with all these things. You can work off any bad diet but in your late twenties into your thirties you can’t do that. You have to eat well. I was overweight in 1st year of med school and there came a point like ‘I can’t do this to myself, this maintaining my health is for my sanity and I owe it to myself. I don’t care if I’m super busy, I should be able to find a half hour or an hour.’ So I bought a treadmill and bought weights. In my little basement so I had no reason not to work out. I was waking up super early, getting my workout in 1st thing in the morning and then just trying to crush as much studying as I could in the in the morning hours because I knew once I came home from school there’s no work getting done for hours because my son my wife I mean I need to be there for them.I was not the best husband and father during those years… I don’t think I was able to do that very well. I tried but I think I could’ve done better.” – A common theme is that Jonny is always disappointed or never satisfied with his performance or what he’s done. He always thinks he could have done better.

At What Point Did You Think About Becoming a NASA Astronaut?

“Space was never on the horizon…Where I came from, that scared little boy who grew up under my father’s shadow I never thought I could have been a SEAL or a doctor or an astronaut there’s no way.”

“In learning a little bit more about how astronauts have had the opportunity to represent humanity for good and bring together countries in a way that politics and alliances cannot do when you talk to some of the Apollo astronauts who went in on the moon and they did their international travel, the feedback they would get from people would be we did it. We did it together it wasn’t you Americans did it it was we did it… Countries could come together and see that as a human accomplishment so there’s something about space that takes away those borders because when you’re up there you don’t see these distinct borders between countries you just see a lot of blue and a lot of land and you see how fragile the planet is. Once I learned a little bit about that type of impact and that you can have a huge impact on the next generation of explorers or scientists or people who want to be a better version of themself. Maybe I could reach out to those kids just like me who are scared tired who don’t think they can amount to anything who don’t think they’re worth anything if I can reach out to them and let them know that ‘hey it doesn’t matter where you’re from with the right attitude or the right hard work if you get up every time you fail you can amount to something in life. You can do positive work, you can leave a good impact, a positive mark for our world.’ That meant a lot to me and that’s when I put my name in the hat. I wanted to be an astronaut because it was completely consistent with my goals that I promised my Mark and Ryan and a long list of our brothers who are not here with us today that I would for the rest of my life do something to impact positive good in our world.’

NASA

“Through just random circumstances I got in and met a former astronaut named Scott Parazynski who is also a physician and served with the shuttle during the shuttle era and had a lot of great missions and huge impact. Listening to him talk passionately about our space program kind of gave me the idea. And then just like in teams I just research what it meant to be, what the requirements were and realized like with my math degree it was consistent with that getting a medical degree having operational experience working in close teams making hard decisions with limited data under constrained times those were all consistent with the traits and experiences that NASA was looking for. So through an accident or whatever you want to call it I was able to have this privilege and honor to serve our nation.”

NASA Selection Process

He was a year into a residency at Massachusetts General Hospital when he learned that he had been selected out of a pool of 18,000 applicants to become a NASA astronaut. The call came while he was grocery shopping. “I think my heart was racing 100 beats a second, and I tried not to lose my composure in the middle of the grocery store,but once I got the news and I hung up, I ran over to my wife, and I was jumping up and down and telling her that we got in.”
His class included 11 NASA candidates and two Canadian Space Agency candidates. They completed two years of training, including spacewalking, robotics, International Space Station systems and Russian, to become eligible for spaceflight.
“It was fun, really really fun. You do things that you have never done before. There were some obstacles like you’d take a piece of paper and you’re with your group and you need to get from point a to point b. But you can’t touch the grass in between you and point a and point b. You might have a barrel or a piece of wood or some string or something you need to devise a way to utilize the resources you have and work effectively in a team to accomplish your mission and that’s like just one example of some of the team based things.”
“There were some long and a lot of interviews, a lot of tests. I really can’t go into the details but we we’re taking these personality tests and tests in psychology.”
“I think you learn a lot about someone when you squeeze them. Because in an 8 to 5 office job you can put on a ‘mask’ and be whoever you want to be for that period of time you can fool a lot of people with it. But when people are squeezed, when you strip away that comfort and they are tired and hungry and cold and suffering that armor just gets melted away and you start to see the true core characteristics and that’s why we do Hell Week in BUDs. Where you want to strip away all that armor and see what is left of that person and that is someone you want by your side. When you are in your darkest days because you’re getting in the heat of battle and you’re getting fired upon you want that person that you know is not going to quit.”
- Similar to Toto Wolff – “How you cope and how you behave in moments of failure is in my opinion, you can see right into the soul of somebody.”
“We (NASA) want people who have that dynamic leadership, who understand human emotion, who can speak to a classroom of 5th graders or 3rd graders. Who can garner and share that passion of reading or space exploration. It’s why it’s important to study the sciences but at the same time be able to talk to a group of engineers… It’s an operational environment where we have to make real time decisions that have real risks so that we can stay sharp and learn to exercise that operational decision making during stressful times. So you need someone who can fill all these rules in and push when the going gets tough.”

NASA Training

“Every day is different. I explain it like being in grad school but with a more physical component to it. There’s certain boxes to check, you need to do like you need to get a certain proficiency in speaking Russian in learning to fly the jet…. Then learning how to operate the spacesuit. We have this huge pool that has a one to one scale of the speciation in Houston and learning because we don’t have in a way to emulate 0 gravity on Earth obviously but we have buoyancy and we can make neutral buoyancy to emulate what it’s like to be in a 0 or microgravity environment. How it feels to work in a pressurized suit to move along and replace batteries and work on drills on the space station. You learn geology, we go on trips to learn about various aspects of rock formations, how they form, why they form, and what’s important because it’s all relative. When we go to Mars, we go to the moon, we may not be able to bring the subject matter experts. We don’t need to be subject matter experts but we need to know and understand. We need to have a foundation so that we can go out and make effective use of the time. We have to get the rocks that subject matter experts at home think are useful so that we can learn more about the moon and Mars and bring that knowledge back to earth to benefit humanity. So every day is different.”
“We are looking to go back to the moon in 2024 with our eyes set for deeper exploration to Mars and beyond. But it starts off with getting back to the moon and setting up and deploying a sustained presence so our job right now if you’re not assigned is to support those ongoing missions in various capacities…. We’re under a program that we have called Artemis we will send the 1st woman and the next man back to the moon and have our eye sights set with boots on the ground on the moon by 2024.”

“I still have and hope that I will continue to have this attitude where I’m just happy to be here. have an immense opportunity that so many deserving people don’t have to work in NASA… I feel if I never flew it would still be an honor to serve… I may be ineligible for spaceflight. It’s not time wasted though. I would still feel very privileged and it would be a huge honor to support ongoing missions. So I don’t know when I’ll be assigned and I don’t care. I will be happy with whatever I had the honor of doing and I will fulfill any role to the best of my abilities. The future is bright.”

Building Up Leadership Trust

“Being a good leader is being a good follower 1st. Having that emotional human social intelligence of what to do and when to do it and how you do it and that’s so important. Craft that language with that tone of voice. I think there is no template to leadership and people need to find their own way of executing that. For me I listen, I sit back and I believe in quality over quantity of what you say. In my experience the less you say the more thoughtful It is the more people listen. The more you speak and oftentimes when you speak a lot it’s less thoughtful. The less people listen and I try to exercise that in everything I do, especially at NASA. In a seal platoon learning to gain currency what I mean by currency is, you can call it reputation whatever you want leadership capital capital. Gaining this capital, what I’ve seen to be effective for others and myself is shutting up and doing a good job and not complaining but speaking when it is appropriate, respectfully and thoughtfully you gain that currency. So hopefully one day when you do need to bark orders because of time sensitivity or just the situation calls for it you can cash in that currency you’ve gained enough and that the people around you and your teammates will be like Roger that I’m going to follow because you have gained my trust.”

“I’m a firm believer that shared hardship and suffering is one of the best ways to bring people together towards a common goal, to break down barriers, to form a brotherhood”

‘There Is No Glass Ceiling': This USD Alum is Now a Navy SEAL, Harvard Doc, and NASA Astronaut

Stories from the Summit – Dr.Jonny Kim

https://medium.com/mind-cafe/helpless-kid-gets-abused-by-dad-becomes-navy-seal-doctor-and-astronaut-c21255a4453

The Unimaginable Path | Jonny Kim (Navy SEAL, Harvard MD, NASA) on the Jocko Podcast #221

https://www.bullhorn.fm/jockopodcast/posts/221-the-unimaginable-path-of-jonny-kim

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/2020/01/14/nasaastronautjonnykim/

“Not everybody can be famous but everybody can be great, because greatness is determined by service.” ― Martin Luther King Jr.